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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 12:34:36 GMT -5
But you gotta cut Ian some slack, he's human and he has 100x more energy than I have and I'm 28 years younger! I don't know how he does all this touring, its bloody hard work. I'm surprised he doesn't blow his top more often Well said. If we all had to do what Ian does for a living, the pressure would be unbearable. I respect him for all he has done and continues to do. 38 seconds does not change that.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 12:44:40 GMT -5
But you gotta cut Ian some slack, he's human and he has 100x more energy than I have and I'm 28 years younger! I don't know how he does all this touring, its bloody hard work. I'm surprised he doesn't blow his top more often Well said. If we all had to do what Ian does for a living, the pressure would be unbearable. I respect him for all he has done and continues to do. 38 seconds does not change that. Jim, I'm sure everyones had thier 38 seconds worth of madness at sometime in their life, but what's your view on the printed comments which are 'unprovoked' and quite derogatory of a lot of fans, even a few digs in the current GB blog. I'd be interested how far ian could push some people before they say enough is enough.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 13:05:24 GMT -5
I think it is a lot more then his 38 seconds that enrage people...
I dont like to be told to fuck off and like it by Ian or anyone else for that matter.
I also did not like his shit he said about the USA in 2004 and had radio stations ban his music.
I do not like it when he can do no wrong in some peoples eyes. I will give everyone a do over even two but Ian has had far more than one or two. He is great performer, a great musician, and songwriter.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 13:11:28 GMT -5
Jim, you bastard, you just called me simple minded, didn't you? Jeff The only name in the quote you have used is Ian. Perhaps Ian is being simple minded? There are those who would rush to judgement over a 38 second video without all the facts. I cannot condone Ian's comments. However I cannot see him or the individual he is yelling at either. Those are the Facts. Perhaps you can find a better clip on you tube to draw a conclusion? The Facts.....hmmmm Were you on the OJ Simpson jury Jim? If you weren't I think the defense team was looking for you! Since 1971 I have seen Ian go off around 5 or 6 times. Most of these are on boots or video, (evidence) some where "called for" and some were just nasty. This was nasty. I don't need any more proof than what was shown. As much as I am a fan of Ian and Tull I will not stand and take the over spray of spit meant for someone else near me.
These are a few things that Ian could've done instead of interrupting the performance and cussing out not only the offending party but also a bunch of nice folks that paid his salary that evening. Ian could've: A. Ignored the problem and gone on playing like a real trooper. B. mentioned his problem with out cussing. "Shut the Fuck up!" is a bit extreme) I've heard him do this more eloquently. Yes Jim I believe it was actually Ian that said it without anymore "evidence". C. Mentioned the problem between songs without disrupting and marring the performance for everyone that wasn't guilty of bothering and/or distracting him.
There were (I'm betting, without evidence) 99.9 % of people in the audience that are also being "scolded" that WERE enjoying the show quietly, that THEY PAID for and instead got a big FUCK YOU during the performance. FACT IS there were far more people in the audience that got a bad show because Ian decided to lose his temper at TWO people that night. Actually this whole issue would've just gone away after Jeff's post if you weren't arguing the point so consistently and insinuating that those of us, that have known for years that Ian can be a twat sometimes, are somehow simple minded for taking issue with it. Jim, I think Ian Anderson is and has been one of the most unique performers, musician songwriters frontman in rock history, but I cannot and will not leave hickies on Ian's ass cheeks the size that you seem to want to do. I have contributed greatly to his comfortable life, I want a good show, thats all. So on that note, I hope some asshole next to you at your next show gives Ian reason to blow and we'll see your review of the concert.... Darin Fucking Cody
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 13:16:59 GMT -5
The only name in the quote you have used is Ian. Perhaps Ian is being simple minded? There are those who would rush to judgement over a 38 second video without all the facts. I cannot condone Ian's comments. However I cannot see him or the individual he is yelling at either. Those are the Facts. Perhaps you can find a better clip on you tube to draw a conclusion? The Facts.....hmmmm Were you on the OJ Simpson jury Jim? If you weren't I think the defense team was looking for you! Since 1971 I have seen Ian go off around 5 or 6 times. Most of these are on boots or video, (evidence) some where "called for" and some were just nasty. This was nasty. I don't need any more proof than what was shown. As much as I am a fan of Ian and Tull I will not stand and take the over spray of spit meant for someone else near me.
These are a few things that Ian could've done instead of interrupting the performance and cussing out not only the offending party but also a bunch of nice folks that paid his salary that evening. Ian could've: A. Ignored the problem and gone on playing like a real trooper. B. mentioned his problem with out cussing. "Shut the Fuck up!" is a bit extreme) I've heard him do this more eloquently. Yes Jim I believe it was actually Ian that said it without anymore "evidence". C. Mentioned the problem between songs without disrupting and marring the performance for everyone that wasn't guilty of bothering and/or distracting him.
There were (I'm betting, without evidence) 99.9 % of people in the audience that are also being "scolded" that WERE enjoying the show quietly, that THEY PAID for and instead got a big FUCK YOU during the performance. FACT IS there were far more people in the audience that got a bad show because Ian decided to lose his temper at TWO people that night. Actually this whole issue would've just gone away after Jeff's post if you weren't arguing the point so consistently and insinuating that those of us, that have known for years that Ian can be a twat sometimes, are somehow simple minded for taking issue with it. Jim, I think Ian Anderson is and has been one of the most unique performers, musician songwriters frontman in rock history, but I cannot and will not leave hickies on Ian's ass cheeks the size that you seem to want to do. I have contributed greatly to his comfortable life, I want a good show, thats all. So on that note, I hope some asshole next to you at your next show gives Ian reason to blow and we'll see your review of the concert.... Darin Fucking Cody Well stated Darin!!
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 13:25:46 GMT -5
Jim, I'm sure everyones had thier 38 seconds worth of madness at sometime in their life, but what's your view on the printed comments which are 'unprovoked' and quite derogatory of a lot of fans, even a few digs in the current GB blog. I'd be interested how far ian could push some people before they say enough is enough. God Bless you Pat. If Ian thinks Americans are drunks then no doubt he has seen a few. I'm sure he has seen more than his share in every country he goes to. I would expect his comments are based on years of touring and not just recently.
Many times he just says things off the top of his head without being diplomatic. Am I concerned? Only when he says F*ck the World and no more touring. That could happen in the near future regardless of how many fans are still happy to enjoy what he does. I want Martin to keep doing what he wants to as well.
I don't let comments about unruly crowds or people have an affect on me. Those things happen when and where they happen. I just want to hear great music and see a great performance. That is why I am a Tull Fan. So far I have never been disappointed.
p.s The GB Blog is very tongue in cheek. He can say all kinds of things...he's Gerald. ;D
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 13:41:17 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 13:44:36 GMT -5
Hey JIm....
You might not take offense by it....but I certainly do..
.I also dont like it when he tell people to fuck off
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 13:55:42 GMT -5
Hey JIm.... You might not take offense by it. ...but I certainly do.. .I also dont like it when he tell people to fuck off
Neither you or I were there. The video does not show what led up to that moment. We don't know what happened before the 38 second video began. I can't go back in time to find out. I will let you know what happens on September 28th.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 14:10:19 GMT -5
Jim
it's good that we, and that means several of us can have such an open and passionate debate without resorting to names calling or telling one another to 'fuck off', that's because despite political differences and views on favourite guitarists we tend to do it with banter and a laugh. It'll be good if we can all keep it that way
Ian's outburst seemed to me to be vitriolic in the extreme. I can forgive him that simply because it is a 38 second outburst and we have no idea as to what provoked it and what else he may have had to deal with that day, bad moods can sometimes stretch out. But given his eloquence in interviews I think he could have handled it better.
The comments he made in interviews are more barbed and deliberate. fine if he says one or two fans wind him up, they do me, but to tarnish a whole nation's fan base for being loud mouthed drunks, or tell fans to fuck off and shoot themselves if they wish to discuss his choice of replacement guitarist seems a little OTT in my books. I wonder how he would have felt if someone had done exactly that, stranger things have happend in the world of star and fan relationships.
I have the utmost respect for Ian as a talented musician and songwriter, generally one of the most professional and consumate entertainers/performers I have ever had the luck to see.
But like all of us, he can be an arse at times.
As for GB being a fictional character how many people hold hard with the fact that GB is IA is GB, you don't have to look back to far in people's posts to see that. An alias gives one so much room to fiddle the facts or say what you really think.
I'm with the comment Paul made, 'It's all gravy these days', I'm still a Tull fan always will be, and will alwasy want to be linked to The Board, because we can doscuss things like this in this way, but the only thing I have in Ian's pocket is a reasonably sizeable chunk of my earlier income, he owes me now't and likewise for me.
Still it's lead to a lively thread, lets now turn to some of our other recent threads and pick them up :-)
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 14:27:50 GMT -5
Maybe that makes me simple minded too. Of course I never called anyone that earlier.
You may not have called anyone simple-minded directly, but you clearly implied that people here who criticized Ian's treatment of the fan were being simple-minded and were seing things in black and white, because, according to you, they were "rushing to judgment."
Why don't you be honest? That's exactly what you meant and intended. Everyone here read it the same way.
Jeff
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Post by TM on Jul 25, 2012 15:57:25 GMT -5
You're gray area ranges from extreme liberalism to radical liberalism. I relative terms I may appear to be all of those things. However, the term 'Simple Minded' could apply to Ian as well. I was opening up the possibility that his actions were not the best. But if rushing to judgement on a 38 second video fits the description, that too could be 'Simple Minded'.How is Liberalism involved in this? You were discussing your views and how you don't see things black and white, remember? I stated my support for Ian after watching that clip, but at the same time I can appreciate the opinions of those who are turned off by it. It's not the first time Ian has gone off on a audience member, so I would not have labeled anyone simple-minded for being turned off by it. And I wouldn't surmise it was simply because Martin is not involved in this project as well. This has turned into quite a thread!
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 25, 2012 17:03:07 GMT -5
Yes this is a disturbing video. I suppose we all have opinions that are valid. As with many things, it seems very simple. Serge did not hear what was happening other than Ian through the microphone. Before we jump to conclusions, we should give Ian some benefit of doubt.
I've never been to a show where Ian or anyone has disrupted a Tull concert.
Maybe Ian has been an asshole at times. Perhaps he was this time too. I'm not going to pile on because I feel betrayed about some former member not on this tour. We all need to take a deep breath and give Ian some measure of innocent until proven guilty.
Life is only simple to simple minded people. They see everything in Black and White. Not me. Nothing political in any of this. Nothing is directed as a personal attack. If you feel I was attacking anyone you are mistaken.
Black and White = Good and Evil = Right and Wrong
The personal stuff began a long time ago with Ian's so called treatment of Martin. I don't keep a list of every thing Ian has ever said that pissed me off. I do enjoy the music and incredible lyrics that he continues play live in many countries.
Simple
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Post by Nonfatman on Jul 25, 2012 21:09:03 GMT -5
Hey JIm.... You might not take offense by it. ...but I certainly do.. .I also dont like it when he tell people to fuck off
Neither you or I were there. The video does not show what led up to that moment. We don't know what happened before the 38 second video began. I can't go back in time to find out. I will let you know what happens on September 28th.Jim, this is not an isolated instance of Ian insulting and disgracing an audience member who did not adhere to his strict code of absolute and utter silence, and various other behavioral regulations. He's done it many, many times. It's a pattern with him. He's known for it. He said several times in the AND interview that people who don't like the fact that Martin was not included on Brick 2 can go fuck themselves, shoot themselves and fuck off. He constantly insults U.S. audiences for being drunken, boorish louts, and even attacked U.S patriotism in the months that followed 9/11. I love him as a musician and songwriter, but I frequently find his comments in interviews and behavior onstage to be tremendously disappointing. The only thing heard on the tape posted by Janu is Ian's totally asshole-like and disgusting abuse of the fan, which was totally uncalled for, unjustified, unprofessional and an utter disgrace. There is absolutely no whooping, hooting, hollering or other misconduct by anyone in the crowd. It's not heard on the tape because it didn't happen, and Janu, who was sitting in the second row confirms that there was no shouting or disruptive conduct by anyone in the audience. I'm not quite sure why you don't believe the evidence of your own ears, or why you refuse to believe Janu when he repeatedly has said there was NO audience misbehavior. Frankly, I don't really care if the fan was talking during Ian's performance. It is not a religious service Jim, it's a rock show. A certain amount of talking is to be expected. Plus, there's something unfair and cowardly about Ian's behavior, picking on and humiliating a person like he did, from a position of power, with a microphone, with the fan having no opportunity to defend himself. One day, he'll do that to the wrong person, who will not take kindly to it. Ian's actions were as foolish and ill-advised as they were unjustified. People at rock shows are giddy, excited and many have had a drink or two. In fact, the venues sell alcohol and I'm quite sure Ian receives a share of the alcohol proceeds. Alcohol very often results in talking. If Ian want's to limit people's talking, maybe he should ban alcohol from being sold at his shows. People attend rock shows to drink, have fun and, yes, occasionally talk to their friends about what's being played; they do not attend rock shows to maintain some kind of devout silence that Ian, and you too, apparently feel Ian is entitled to. It's not "simple-minded" to form a judgment based upon the the video, which reflects a typical audience, with no disorderly behavior, and upon the testimony of a trusted friend and member of the Board who was in the second row, and says that the audience was well-behaved. Nobody admires Ian more than Janu does, yet Janu says Ian was way out of line, and that there was nothing that occurred that justified Ian's despicable dressing down of an innocent fan. It's funny because you admit that Ian is human, yet you seem to refuse to believe or admit that he did anything wrong in this instance. I don't get that. The Jethro Tull Board is a fancentric site. We celebrate and honor the Tull Fan more than we do the band. I feel sorry for this fan to be treated like that by the leader of what probably is his favorite band. My sympathies lie with the fan, not with Mr. Nasty. Jeff
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Post by Nonfatman on Jul 25, 2012 21:56:48 GMT -5
Hey JIm.... You might not take offense by it. ...but I certainly do.. .I also dont like it when he tell people to fuck off
Neither you or I were there. The video does not show what led up to that moment. We don't know what happened before the 38 second video began. I can't go back in time to find out. I will let you know what happens on September 28th.Janu was there, okay? He was sitting in the second row. He would have heard any loud disruptions from the audience had they happened. He emphatically denies any such disruptive conduct, and equally emphatically says that Ian was way out of line. You keep ignoring this inconvienent fact. Jeff
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Post by Nonfatman on Jul 25, 2012 22:54:28 GMT -5
Yes this is a disturbing video. I suppose we all have opinions that are valid. As with many things, it seems very simple. Serge did not hear what was happening other than Ian through the microphone. Before we jump to conclusions, we should give Ian some benefit of doubt.
I've never been to a show where Ian or anyone has disrupted a Tull concert.
Maybe Ian has been an asshole at times. Perhaps he was this time too. I'm not going to pile on because I feel betrayed about some former member not on this tour. We all need to take a deep breath and give Ian some measure of innocent until proven guilty.
Life is only simple to simple minded people. They see everything in Black and White. Not me. Nothing political in any of this. Nothing is directed as a personal attack. If you feel I was attacking anyone you are mistaken.
Black and White = Good and Evil = Right and Wrong
The personal stuff began a long time ago with Ian's so called treatment of Martin. I don't keep a list of every thing Ian has ever said that pissed me off. I do enjoy the music and incredible lyrics that he continues play live in many countries.
Simple Who do you think you are kidding? The clear implication of your "life is only simple to simple-minded people" remark was that folks here who criticized Ian's treatment of the fan were simple-minded, because, according to you, there was not enough evidence, despite no disruptive audience conduct being heard on the tape, and despite Janu attesting to the fact that there was nothing that justified Ian's disgraceful outburst. Why don't you be honest? That's exactly what you meant and what you intended. You then tried to get out of your insulting "simple-minded" remark by suggesting that you were referring to Ian as being the simple-minded one. Please. Everyone here, Charlie, myself, Paul, Pat, Darin read it the same way. Jeff
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Post by jtul07 on Jul 26, 2012 6:07:06 GMT -5
My sincere apologies to anyone that felt they were being called simple-minded. I don't wish to worry over this thread any further. It seems to have created a negative feeling since the 38 second video.
Of course we can all return to our Jolly Jethro ways by looking forward to the 1000th member. As well as future concerts that will be coming here very soon. I'm still going. Are you?
I have no more tissue to cry over this issue. God Bless everyone at the Board.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2012 6:35:32 GMT -5
"This is a song called Minstrel in the Gallery and it's about how I'm up here, and you're down there, or is it the other way around?"
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Post by TM on Jul 26, 2012 8:55:13 GMT -5
In many cases it is best to not to meet the musician (or actor, athlete, etc.) that you admire. Fans often end up disappointed.
The other thing that comes to mind is that Ian seemed to be much more relaxed performing as a solo artist. Perhaps the bloom's off the rose?
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Post by flutestobranches on Jul 26, 2012 13:27:45 GMT -5
In many cases it is best to not to meet the musician (or actor, athlete, etc.) that you admire. Fans often end up disappointed. The other thing that comes to mind is that Ian seemed to be much more relaxed performing as a solo artist. Perhaps the bloom's off the rose? Good point, TM! I THINK it was Toulouse-Lautrec who said: "One should never meet the artist whose work one admires, the man is always so much less than the art." I have never met Ian Anderson and don't want to; I don't want the soundtrack to my life to be ruined by the chance that he might be having a bad day that day, or may just be a disagreeable person. For a thirty-second encounter, what's the point? -- David
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2012 16:15:32 GMT -5
a couple of years ago I did a little image for my avatar, Ian gives the finger. I logged onto FB today to see it had spread on the back of the SJI [The San Javier Incident], the best one being this mock up. I am now taking orders for it as a large canvas and have offered it to the Royal Mail as a possible Olympic stamp.....
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Post by Nonfatman on Jul 26, 2012 16:29:47 GMT -5
In many cases it is best to not to meet the musician (or actor, athlete, etc.) that you admire. Fans often end up disappointed. The other thing that comes to mind is that Ian seemed to be much more relaxed performing as a solo artist. Perhaps the bloom's off the rose? Good point, TM! I THINK it was Toulouse-Lautrec who said: "One should never meet the artist whose work one admires, the man is always so much less than the art." I have never met Ian Anderson and don't want to; I don't want the soundtrack to my life to be ruined by the chance that he might be having a bad day that day, or may just be a disagreeable person. For a thirty-second encounter, what's the point? -- David Good post, David, there is definitely the risk of a letdown when meeting your musical heros. That has not happened during my several backstage meeting with Ian, in fact on two occasions they were hilarious, and quite memorable. There was one time as he was leaving the show I said something obsequious to him, and he responded with sarcasm. In general, you stand a much better chance if you have something intelligent or interesting to say to Ian. If you can engage him with something out of the ordinary, or something that catches his fancy, he will talk to you. Jeff
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Post by Nonfatman on Jul 26, 2012 16:56:06 GMT -5
My sincere apologies to anyone that felt they were being called simple-minded. I don't wish to worry over this thread any further. It seems to have created a negative feeling since the 38 second video.
Of course we can all return to our Jolly Jethro ways by looking forward to the 1000th member. As well as future concerts that will be coming here very soon. I'm still going. Are you?
I have no more tissue to cry over this issue. God Bless everyone at the Board. It's already forgotten. You know I love you, ya big, Ian-lovin' lug! For me, it's more complicated. As my favorite Latin lyric poet CaTULLus wrote, in his brief little poem: 'Odi et Amo.' [See Odes of Catullus thread here: thejethrotullboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=651&page=1]Of course, I'm going to the Brick show at The Beacon, the only show I'm seeing on this tour. With so many Tull friends that are going to be there, and with Danno coming down, there's no way I would miss it. I just hope they play the two full Bricks, though! Jeff
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Post by janu on Jul 29, 2012 3:40:37 GMT -5
Well, checkin' your debate, some not lacking of dispute , I've understood that someone is still doubting what really happened that night about, so I'll say again that what I witnessed was certainly an upset Ian spitting antipathy words from his mouth towards someone who just committed a mistake: talking easily to his partner, and I firmly say that because i was sitting at not too far from the facts happened and from where I did not ever listen any shouting voice, then I promise you what I tell you. After that the show went on normally til its end and not getting My God or Aqualung from the band maybe impelled by the related sad incidents. The End. As I stated before the flood ;D my wife and me got before the show backstage cards thanks to the kind Tullianos bunch who also attended this unforgettable ;D show. Mine I don't have a strong liking of the San Javier show tickets This is my Thick As A Brick CD front cover signed by Ian and Martin, signatures both just made in a four days time difference, Martin at Gavá feast and Ian at SJJF, curious and interesting facts at the same time. Also you can see on this cover the Dee's, Maartin Allcock's and Dan Crisp's signatures. John O'hara's and David Goodier's signatures on my TAAB 1 inside cover Florian's one Ryan's one
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Post by TM on Jul 29, 2012 19:28:51 GMT -5
a couple of years ago I did a little image for my avatar, Ian gives the finger. I logged onto FB today to see it had spread on the back of the SJI [The San Javier Incident], the best one being this mock up. I am now taking orders for it as a large canvas and have offered it to the Royal Mail as a possible Olympic stamp..... I must have this!
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